ok now i am really confused!! (Leave gas in mags or not)

[krazikev]

i have a green gas rifle and was told by 3 forums and one local store to always leave a little gas in the mag. now i went to another local airsoft store and i spoke to a 30 year veteran of co2 and green gas. he has been playing airsoft since it started and makes a LIVING selling and servicing these guns, he even services the guns on all 200 memebers of his airsoft club/team. so with all this exsperiance i thought he would tell me the same thing about storing alittle gas in the mag. when done. to my serprise he said the oppisite!! he told me it in this way and i quote " never keep any preasure of gas AT ALL in the mag. that the preasure just sitting there will cause seal damage and then he brought up two good examples first he said think about this way, even though c02 and green gas are differant gases, the preasure is the same, and by leaving preasure in the gun (of a co2) which has the same rubber seals) is not good, now we all know that you should never leave even a little gas in a co2 so why leave it in a green gas mag.? coper bb guns use co2 and the companys that make them ALWAYS say not to store a bb gun with preasure of a co2 in it, then he said this, the day a manufactuer finishes making a green gas mag. do they put a little gas in it? no, that mag. can sit for a year or two before it makes it from the plant being made to being ordered by the store and then the store keeping it on the self for a while before me and you buy it. so does the seal get damaged? no if anything after you and i use it it has a little bit of microscopic gas in it even empty. and we all know that green gas is made of propane and SILICONE which will protect the seal anyway.then he went on to say that who do i know that ever experimented on never leaving a little gas in it for storage, no one, we all were always told to leave a little gas in it. so maybe this is why we replace seals in our magz. ever year or so due to the preasure always damaging the seals. well i have to say the idea he brought up about the copper co2 bb guns (that have been around before airsoft) that makes sence cause i was always told never to leave any gas co2 wheather a lttle gas in it or not in a bb gun, the preasure wil ruin the seal and i remember doing that has a kid and a year or so later the seal was really ruined. and another thing the seals in a mag is always lubed up from damage cause we always spray silicine oil on thenm after use for the day.


here is a link on that:

http://www.ehow.com/how_2302319_use-co2-bb-gun.html

and this link proves that your magz. seals are being lubed anyway

[vulrath]

First up, CO2 is much, MUCH more powerful than green gas. CO2's unregulated resting pressure at room temperature is above 500 PSI, while green gas (propane) has a much lower unregulated resting pressure of 100-120 PSI at the same temperature. Quite a difference there. If your guy is making lateral comparisons between leaving a gun charged with CO2 and leaving one with some green gas, then he's, quite frankly, a complete and utter dunderhead, regardless of how long he's played. The difference in pressures (see above) necessitate different handling procedures.

I don't know who he's been ordering from, but all the mags I've purchased (with or without the gun, and from multiple vendors) that had a small amount of gas (I guess left over from quality assurance testing, but the point is that it was there). Hell, the GHK mag I bought from Redwolf had enough gas to cycle the bolt a couple of times.

Third, while you can leave your mags empty (I usually do because it's easier than fooling with it, but that's me being lazy), it actually is bad for the mag. The lack of pressure on the o-rings allows them to lose their shape and will eventually start to leak (well, more quickly than if you were to keep the mag gassed up, because despite the best of intentions the mag will leak eventually, and you'll have to repair it).

EDIT: spotted some typos, and removed them.

[Lancer]

Hi, I hope I can help with this question as well:

First things first:

Gases in airsoft (excluding HPA) are stored in their liquid form while in the magazine or canister from which they came. The reason this process is used is because it allows a far greater magazine capacity of the gasses and as such allows their use in airsoft applications. Now here is the difference: In order to get CO2 to form a liquid you must place it under a far greater pressure than propane at any given temperature (this has to do primarily with the size of the CO2 molecule, being much smaller than the propane molecule). What all this means is that CO2 and Propane are not stored at the same pressure, and that the CO2 is at a much higher pressure than propane in guns.

Given the higher pressure of CO2, perhaps he is right that it isn't a great idea to store them pressurized, I for one have never really done much with CO2 in airsoft applications. I should point out here that the reason most manuals tell you to not leave it loaded with propane is for the same reason you don't store a real gun with ammunition: It's dangerous, especially if you forget about it (and then leave it in a hot car, for example).

I do, however, have a large amount of experience with green gas (propane). It is far better to leave it in the magazine than to leave the magazine empty as it helps to keep all the O rings in shape. It certainly does not make them weaker. I have a magazine to an old HFC M9 lying around here somewhere that I put into storage 2-3 years ago, and I know for a fact it is still holding propane. More often than not, when I forget to put gas in the magazine I tend to have issues with it later and it requires a fair amount of lube (and gas) to get the O rings to seal again. That is my personal experience with it.

So, in conclusion, the differences between propane and CO2 necessitate different procedures when storing, but one should definitely leave the propane magazines with gas in them.

A final note, it doesn't matter how much gas you leave in, be it a little or completely full, as it will always be at the same pressure as long as there is any liquid in there at all. The only time this could conceivably cause an issue is if the magazine heats up in which case having less liquid is better. But again, for normal use, it does not matter how much you store in the magazine. (I myself often leave them full). Also, if you will be storing them between games while using propane, be sure to add a bit of silicon into the magazine before you pressurize it for storage. This will ensure the seals stay good.

I hope this helps.

~Lancer

[SekiRyu]

Of my 3 KWA USP mags and 2 Marui 1911 mags, I've left gas in 3 of them for at least 6 months with no ill effect. The other 2 mags that I left empty were fine as well. From what I can tell, it really doesn't matter either way.